1/6/09 12:37 PM

Wednesday Links & Open Thread

Latest cable news links [updated through the day]:

Hi-Def complicates newsgathering.

Tuesday's numbers. Weekly ranker. Rasmussen claims partisan segmentation.

Video: Kelly's Court rules on Edwards vs Enquirer.

Paris, meet Paris?

Dana Milbank disinvited from Countdown for defending McCain advisor!? Analysis.

MSNBC's Decision '08 dashboard.

Neil Cavuto on Good Morning America.

Are the Chinese still holding a CNN grudge?

Greta: Arirang pix.

Alexis Glick: "Dear Senator Obama..."

Hotline quotes.

United Against Olbermann?

More Matthews scuttlebutt. Proposed code name.

Jamming 101.

FNC propels NewsCorp earnings.

J$P 24-Hour Poll:


Use our valuable bandwidth to post your cable news comments in today's open thread.




Mike C.
I voted for E.D. Hill, but Heather Nauert's good, too.
August 6, 2008, 1:34:23 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
I voted for ED too, Mike. She is very fair, quick-witted, and wizened by her years of motherhood and life experience. Nauert is excellent eye candy but isn't ready for FNC's 5PM slot. Give her 10 more years of experience and I'd consider equating her with ED.
August 6, 2008, 7:04:39 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
I went for John Gibson.  
 
I miss GIbby!
August 6, 2008, 9:12:21 AM EDT – Like – Reply


cornycob
I would like E.D. and Gibby to co-host together. I say give them a two-hour broadcast from 4-6. It would make all the liberals angry. Plus, I think they would be very good.
August 6, 2008, 9:23:24 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I didn't vote, since all I would really be doing is voting against Gibson and Ingraham. I have to save my negative votes for the next gubernatorial election.
 
My sense is FNC must be rather happy to have Gibson off the air. He seems to have been (almost) universally viewed as the dimmest bulb in the box. That was never my problem with him. I tended to view him as "A Man for All Seasons," who after repositioning himself on the right, spouted the Talking Point Du Jour as if it were an original concept by him. Plus, he has a voice, a whiney, high-pitched Nellie Olsenesque pout which makes my neck throb and ache from the base to the hard cartilage ridge just below the ears.
 
Why not Greta? I realize this isn't prime time, but it is a window for serious news. Doocy or one of the other bimbos at FNC could do the White Gone Missing show. I'd like to see Greta do real news again.
August 6, 2008, 9:45:18 AM EDT – Like – Reply


lyons
Why does FNC keep putting blonds on all the anchor desks?
I would like to see a strong male voice doing the election news.
I don't want to seem sexist. But I think a male would have more gravitas in this slot.
My choice is James Rosen.
August 6, 2008, 10:13:29 AM EDT – Like – Reply


sharm
Greta is in North Korea now. I don't think the missing white girl theme is accurate or that she is forced to cover the stories by her producer (per Olby). Is there even a missing white girl story in the headlines? She has an ongoing interest in the legal process. When she covers missing people, I believe she does it out of compassion. She is not an anchorwoman.
August 6, 2008, 10:18:43 AM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Gibby. :+:
August 6, 2008, 10:35:23 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
There's always a missing white girl, Sharon. Our entire culture depends on it, it would seem. And, perhaps, Greta's impetus is concern and compassion, but in the Holloway case she became as tacky, tawdry and exploitive as Grace. Even Hannity and a couple of personalities at MSNBC got in on the act.
 
Greta is an excellent legal reporter, however. One of the very best. Her talents in this regard have never been effectively used by FNC. FNC seems content to allow legal amateurs, like the All Star Panel, do its legal reporting.
 
Perhaps, she wouldn't be the best choice for this position, as you indicate. But, I sense Greta is ready for some very serious, on-going work. I hope she is utilized to the full extent of her notable skill and talent.
August 6, 2008, 10:39:01 AM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
United Against Olbermann
 
They did not name the offended party, but I'll venture to a guess, Ollie North, the overturned on a technicallity former WH operative.
 
One would hope that their outrage at ridicule of a veteran extended to Sen John Kerry, but somehow I doubt it. (Purple Heart bandaids at the Convention, how vulgar)
 
And then there was this:"The last thing Olbermann would want to see come from his antics would be to raise support for a former army officer running for Congress" Is this true?
 
Well,if so, he will still have former Sec of the Navy and Republican Senator from Virginia, John Warner, to kick him around again, as happened when Ollie ran for Senate.
August 6, 2008, 10:42:48 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Could there be a better recommendation for our Gibby!  
 
John Gibson it is, everyone!!
 
Thanks, Mark!
August 6, 2008, 10:47:14 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
You're welcome, Cecelia, and I would be content with the selection. Gibson's cerebral cavity density is always good for at least one laugh a day. Perhaps, we'll both get a pick up.*
 
---
 
*Emotional, spirtual, not vehicular.
August 6, 2008, 10:53:32 AM EDT – Like – Reply


sharm
I think Greta is content where she is and not wringing her hands about how she is being under-utilized. She actually may know and have interviewed a few more people than you. She may have even been a few more places, for instance, North Korea.
August 6, 2008, 10:56:22 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Well, you do a good job in that yourself, Mark. I'm sure Gibson would appreciate the professional recommendation...
August 6, 2008, 10:57:24 AM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
I'm still trying to get my head around someone who thinks Oliver North is a "former Army officer", let alone one running for Congress.
August 6, 2008, 11:07:00 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I hope Greta still has enough fire in her belly that she wants to do even more, on an ON-GOING basis, as I indicated. By the same token, I am sure there is something to be said for the contentment which comes from mind-numbing repetition. I may be wrong about Greta, but I just can't believe she is such a person, such a professional.
 
On another matter: Why don't we suggest a trip to North Korea for Gibson? The knee-knocking would keep the other passengers on the aircraft awake all night and I am sure that the Ann Richards-style do would result in a secondary frontier inspection, but I am thinking we would get some probative, deep reporting.
August 6, 2008, 11:21:10 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Is he knee-knocking with anyone we know?
August 6, 2008, 11:24:45 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Ashley
"Blowhards like Olbermann don’t care if they divide a nation. As they attack our military, let us unite against their scurrilous tactics. "
 
Amen.
August 6, 2008, 11:28:08 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
The site, and who says lunacy can't be fun, is talking about Allen West, who is running against Ron Klein, FL-22. West has gained some "notoriety" of late for his belief that Al-Jazeera was trying to kidnap him, in Tampa. West is retired Army. But, I am sure we all knew that.
August 6, 2008, 11:35:20 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Well, Johnny, they read your links, become worked up, get the facts muddled up (even when blog link didn't), and then quickly hit the comment button in order to slap "right winger" cheeks, dueling style, with the day's fresh provocation.
 
It's all your fault, Johnny...
August 6, 2008, 11:37:25 AM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Well I didn't vote for anyone, they all got a big :-:
 
Keith did an outstanding job last night by naming Bill as WPitW....Bill proposes the exact same thing Obama proposed...But for some reason Obama was wrong and he was right...Haggis shakes his head at Bills logic....But now I understand why Keith calls Bill what he does...I'll not say it here as I respect the rules...Even thought they're a bit one sided.
August 6, 2008, 11:37:45 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Is he knee-knocking with anyone we know?
Cecelia | 08.06.08 - 11:29 am | #  
 
---
 
No one I know, but I never fly coach internationally. Over 3 hours, and the client pays "Business or Better". I can't imagine FNC would fly Gibson anything but coach, and probably in the middle seat. Administrative assistants and gate attendants have a way of getting back at obnoxious people. That is why I am always so utterly charming to these fine men and women.
August 6, 2008, 11:38:44 AM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
All of your hate towards Gibson reminds me of your 'fawning' post you made on the olbermann fan site. Gibson must be doing something right for him to be under your skin.
August 6, 2008, 12:05:46 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Here is a brilliant video....It shows the hypocrisy of Hannity absolutely brilliantly.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsHhOr5W6EI
August 6, 2008, 12:21:57 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
11 hours after I made my vote, one things is clear about the rest of the voters: They want John Gibson back! Now! Did I read that correctly?
Outside of Your Word (mail) and My Word (commentary), I couldn't tolerate "The Big Story." I'm sorry. It'll probably be back after the election, but I don't miss it right now. Still, I like John's anti-Olby work on John Gibson Radio.
August 6, 2008, 12:54:14 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
Maybe the reason that Hannity has not been more critical of Nugent is that he could not understand what Nugent was saying. I know I could not understand what Nugent said. I just have to trust the smiley faced commentator. I mean he could have said that Nugent just repeated the Gettysburg address, I would not have known differently.
 
Is this the best the smiley face commentator has? Has Nugent not released any CDs with hateful lyrics, as Ludacris has? Do unintelligible off-the-cuff comments carry the same weight as lyrics that are deliberately recorded and mass distributed?
 
I could understand Ludacris without much help from either subtitles or Bill Maher.
 
If you want to accuse someone of hypocrisy, you will have to do much better than this. I also found the video to be much, much less than brilliant.
August 6, 2008, 1:08:06 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I am sure that now that Hannity knows what Nugent said, he will take the correct action on his show, and thoroughly trash Nugent. Hannity is that type of guy. So, HF, I caution patience so that Hannity will have time to do what is right, proper, fair and balanced.
 


Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 1:32:06 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Ashley
[reply to off-topic politics]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 1:38:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
[off topic politics]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 1:46:00 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
First, you are assuming facts that are not in evidence. How do you know that Hannity now knows what Nugent said? I am sure I don't. Think I trust the smiley faced commenter? Nahhh.
 
I think that it is telling that this is the best he has got.
 
But even assuming that he said it you completely ignore my point that virtually unintelligible off-the-cuff comments don't carry the same weight as lyrics that are penned with aforethought and are mass distributed (not limited to one concert.  
 
As for the rest of your comments . . . about something that happened on Hannity's RADIO SHOW that you did not even try to link to cable news . . . I am laughing at YOU for the abject stupidity you have just demonstrated.
 
Clearly, you tend not to listen very well (as you have already proven) and you have no idea of what Hannity's argument is or you would not have made such a silly moronic comment.
 
I would like to clear things up for you but then I would have to talk about stuff that is not related to cable news . . . kind of like you just did.
August 6, 2008, 1:47:22 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
Hannity's radio show? Why didn't someone tell me. That's off-topic. Move along.
August 6, 2008, 1:53:13 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Obama needs to accept Hannity's invitation to come on H&C as a co-host and "tear Hannity up".

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 1:53:32 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
Unfortunately, Johnny, it doesn't matter what you and I say. We can never steer anyone here back on topic.
August 6, 2008, 1:55:15 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Ashley
[reply to off-topic politics]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 2:01:59 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
> Unfortunately, Johnny, it doesn't matter what you and I say. We can never steer anyone here back on topic.
 
I have some ideas on that score and it may be time to implement them. People think they can run the thread, only discuss what they want to discuss, and ignore the cable news developments of the day, tossing in their favorite political hobby horses as a bonus. We'll see about that.
August 6, 2008, 2:07:03 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
I'm looking forward to the implementation. I hope it comes ASAP.
Meanwhile, the Milbank/Olby battle rages on.
August 6, 2008, 2:13:43 PM EDT – Like – Reply


sharm
I wonder what finally drove Milbank to abandon ship at Countdown? I haven't followed who the filler is now for Milbank with such an "exclusive" list as regulars.
August 6, 2008, 2:16:06 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
[off topic]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 2:20:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I tend to agree with the Chickaboomer scenario, Sharon. It fits with what I believe to be a rather obvious and pathetic pettiness that Olbermann exhibits virtually all the time.
August 6, 2008, 2:23:07 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
[reply to off topic]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 2:26:39 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Sorry, Johnny, I thought the on-air (television) remarks on the lyrics we fair game. I'll be glad to move on.
August 6, 2008, 2:35:59 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
No this whole discussion ran its course some time ago. You may like talking about it, but that doesn't mean everybody else has to wade thru it. It's quite irrelevant to any current cable news developments. I hope my position is clear and that thread hogs are aware of it.
August 6, 2008, 2:38:51 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
[off topic - last warning to all!]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 2:39:30 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
J$ I posted that last comment before I saw your comment 08.06.08 - 2:43 pm...Sorry.
 
I still feel this whole thing is relevant...But as you don't I'll leave it alone.
August 6, 2008, 2:47:52 PM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
Nominating a lieutenant colonel with a history of profound and exemplary dedication to his troops for a foolish and inane “Worst Person in the World” award goes far beyond the pale.
 
Mark | 08.06.08 - 11:40 am |
 
Allen West. I didn't know that. When I saw Lt.Colonel, I thought the worst.Thanx. BTW,any relation to Adam West?
August 6, 2008, 2:48:13 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Seems highly unlikely.
August 6, 2008, 2:54:31 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Msnbc.com Launches Decision '08 Dashboard
 
Looks good....Book marked ready to use over the next couple of months.
In the live vote section Paris is doing very well.  
 
----------
 
What ever happened to the Fox News election vehicles they trumpeted from the roof tops?
August 6, 2008, 3:28:10 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Good lord! It seems that Olbermann's angry, eternally adolescent, obtuse, uncouth, moronic, extremist fans are pushing he and his staff farther and farther into mind-wide-shut status.
August 6, 2008, 3:45:46 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
[message deleted for rules violation: off-topic]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 3:55:39 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
What ever happened to the Fox News election vehicles they trumpeted from the roof tops?
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 3:33 pm |
---
Perhaps, one of the SUV recalls of late?
-----
It seems that Olbermann's angry, eternally adolescent, obtuse, uncouth, moronic, extremist fans are pushing he and his staff farther and farther into mind-wide-shut status.
Cecelia | 08.06.08 - 3:50 pm | #  
---
Ratings-driven, as you clearly suggest. So much of the obnoxious behavior on cable news is ratings-driven, Abrams, Beck, Dobbs, Grace, Hannity, Olbermann, O'Reilly, et al. Do you think that it is possible that the specific behavior to which you object, and to which I object as well, with Olbermann, has some age component driving it? Without getting into a ratings' discussion, I think it is safe to say that Olbermann is seen as cutting edge, more "with it" to borrow a term from our past, than the FNC prime time group which is seen as if not over the hill, trying to capture its breath and looking down.
 
I have the same sense with Anderson Cooper, not that he is particularly obnoxious, but that I can't relate to him as well as my children, to his manner of speaking, his vocabulary, his editorial judgments, because he is not meant to appeal to me.
 
With Olbermann, I sometimes think the juveniles jokes, the double entendres, the passion, the indignation, all are intentional and focused. If we were younger, would we see Olbermann as less obnoxious?
 
I may be dead wrong about this.
August 6, 2008, 4:20:03 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Not at all, Mark. Being a leftist generally means that you're either the stuff of the juvenile detention center or the seemingly manor-ed... insurgent...
 
Being a conservative means you were born with a martini glass in one hand and the complete works of Keats in other.
 
Olbermann panders to who and what he is.
August 6, 2008, 4:43:30 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
I think you are indeed wrong about that (big surprise). Obnoxious behavior is obnoxious behavior no matter what age you are.
 
What is age related is this: younger people don't read newspapers (well, I don't either anymore, but that is beside the point); don't listen to radio talk shows; and don't watch cable news shows. they are also less likely to vote in elections.
 
A traditional cable news show that aims primarily at a younger audience is "spitting into the wind" (to coin a phrase) anyway.
 
If a younger audience is all that matters, probably what Fox or another network should do is get Jay Leno under contract (since he is available). Even though Leno is getting a little grey headed, I believe that he would attract a younger audience. He would be much better at it than Olbermann,
August 6, 2008, 4:48:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Ashley
Love the Anderson Cooper = Paris Hilton ad from Greta. Never saw that before. The one comment by the Fox Hater was laughable.
 
Fox News is #1!
August 6, 2008, 4:49:07 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I had no idea that any conservative even knew who Keats was, Cecelia. I am more of Whitman guy, but we liberals are American, democratic to the very core of our being.
 
I still think age is a factor here, and the fact that Danny attacked me makes me even more certain of that. I just don't know how large a factor.
 
And, Danny, Leno? How very 1988!
August 6, 2008, 4:52:48 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
You all remember this Fox News ad from January 2007, don’t you?
 
"meet the Paris Hilton of television news"
 
This explains a lot..."our man" Ailes has sent the idea over to McCain.
Now we know where the idea for the McCain add came from.
August 6, 2008, 4:54:45 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I like some of the comments in the link. Pretty tough on Greta, and a bit ribald at times, but flashes of wit.
August 6, 2008, 5:02:47 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
Looked at his ratings lately? This is 2008 and Leno still dominates late night talk shows.
 
Younger people (generally speaking) are not that much into politics. They are into humor. Politics laced with humor is more palatable to them than not.
 
That's why Leno would be more successful than an obnoxious Olbermann.
 
You can stubbornly cling to your position if you want, but you are still wrong.
 
And let's be very clear . . . it is your arguments I have attacked and not you.
 
YOu need to learn to tell the difference.
August 6, 2008, 5:08:19 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Thanks, Danny, and have a great evening.
August 6, 2008, 5:11:47 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
You are welcome. Equalmente
August 6, 2008, 5:18:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Ashley
This explains a lot..."our man" Ailes has sent the idea over to McCain.
Now we know where the idea for the McCain add came from.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 4:59 pm | # 
 
More theory masquerading as fact.
 
I think Roger Ailes has enough to do. Besides, an Obama win would likely be a huge windfall for FNC.
 
Great ad though, adds another member to the celebutard list.
August 6, 2008, 5:21:16 PM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
If a young audience is what a network seek, take a hint from the success of Stewart and Colbert. Of course, one has to be somewhat informed to even get their humor, but they are both more insightful, and much better comedians, than Hannity or Olbermann.
 
But speaking of demographics, I'm certain that the advertisers have audience numbers sliced and diced in a multitude of ways. I've lately seen advertisements for the Creation Museum in Tennessee on F&F. 
 
Now this may be local only, I have no way to tell. And this area would be a prime target for this museum's advertising, being just down the road from Dover and all. But a couple weeks ago I saw a flurry of "Hooters" ads on F&F. Is there some overlap between these two target audiences?? It wonders me.
August 6, 2008, 5:25:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
More theory masquerading as fact.
Ashley | 08.06.08 - 5:26 pm |
 
No not fact....just a theory of mine.
 
"Besides, an Obama win would likely be a huge windfall for FNC."
 
How can this be...Obama is supposed to be going to raise taxes for business...."Our man" Ailes will do everything he can to stop this.
August 6, 2008, 5:30:28 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
NVH,
 
I give you the better comedians than Hannity, but not more insightful.
 
Although Leno is probably (but I don't know for sure) a little left of center, he is more fair and balanced than the political comedians than you named. That's why Leno has a broader appeal.
 
Since he is more fair and balanced he would probably be a good fit for Fox News Channel, if Fox News Channel execs decided that they really wanted to go into that direction,
August 6, 2008, 5:32:17 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
"Since he is more fair and balanced he would probably be a good fit for Fox News Channel"
 
Money for a new keyboard please....:lol: :+:
August 6, 2008, 5:36:46 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
Won't help you. No matter how many keyboards you might use, Fox is still the most fair and balanced cable news network.
 
You can tell that not only by its high ratings, but by the makeup of its audience.
August 6, 2008, 5:50:59 PM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
"an Obama win would likely be a huge windfall for FNC."
 
Don't know why Obama's victory will be a windfall for Fox. I think they will just go muddling on their way,except instead of promoting the Executive they will simply switch to being the (dis)loyal opposition, and will attack the executive at every opportunity.I can't see their audience growing,but I'm certain it will not shrink.
 
It's actually easier to criticize a policy than to defend one, so the Fox crew may see this as something of a well-needed break.
August 6, 2008, 5:55:16 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
...but by the makeup of its audience.
Danny | 08.06.08 - 5:55 pm | # 
 
So what your saying with that comment is...The FNC is biased but the audience is "fair and balanced"...Works for me
August 6, 2008, 5:58:23 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
NVH,
 
Are you trying to maneuver the discussion to the pros and cons of Obamas' tax plan?
 
I wouldn't mind discussing that. However, I wonder why you are doing this when you know damn well that is off topic.
 
Are you trying to be obnoxious?
August 6, 2008, 5:59:51 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
No, I would never say something that stupid. I am sure you would though. That's why it works for you,.
August 6, 2008, 6:01:42 PM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
You can tell that not only by its high ratings,
 
Danny | 08.06.08 - 5:55 pm |
 
If you are going to say that looking at the size of the audience proves Fair and Balanced, you are going to have to compare Fox not just to CNN or MSNBC, but to all the MSM; TV newspapers, NPR etc.A couple or 3 million getting their news from Fox against 297 million getting their news elsewhere is not proof of anything.


Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 6:03:50 PM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
"Are you trying to maneuver the discussion to the pros and cons of Obamas' tax plan?"
 
Oh, for the love of Rama. This is one reason why it's frustrating posting here.Some people see what they want to see. Other than the word "windfall', which I quoted from upthread, whatever would lead you to suggest that I am trying to discuss taxes????Try to be attentive.
August 6, 2008, 6:08:24 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
f you are going to say that looking at the size of the audience proves Fair and Balanced, you are going to have to compare Fox not just to CNN or MSNBC, but to all the MSM; TV newspapers, NPR etc.A couple or 3 million getting their news from Fox against 297 million getting their news elsewhere is not proof of anything.
 
BTW,did you ever look at that Pew link I provided that discusses the attitude of Republicans towards the media?
notveryhow | 08.06.08 - 6:08 pm | # 
 
Did you see JD's piece on the "makeup" of FNC's audience?
August 6, 2008, 6:09:24 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
First, newspaper audience and TV audience is shrinking. Secondly, I spoke of makeup of the audience, not just the size. Third, I was comparing Fox to the other news networks
 
Yes I read the article to which you are referring many times. We had a lengthy discussion about it earlier. I told you that I thought the article is totally irrelevant to the points you tried to make and why. You never tried to rebut my rebuttal. I don't intend to replay that lengthy conversation with you now.
 
The short answer to your question is: yes and I stand by what I said about the more diverse makeup of the Fox audience.
August 6, 2008, 6:12:56 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
I had no idea that any conservative even knew who Keats was, Cecelia. 
Mark | 08.06.08 - 4:57 pm | # 
 
Said the seemingly mild manor-ed one.
 
Democratic to the core...
August 6, 2008, 6:14:48 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
If you are going to say that looking at the size of the audience proves Fair and Balanced,
notveryhow | 08.06.08 - 6:08 pm |
 
NVH, excellent point....Going by what Danny said about audience size...All the networks are "fair and balanced" also....Wriggle out of that one.
August 6, 2008, 6:15:42 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Danny, I think by "makeup" they think you meant Clarins.
August 6, 2008, 6:18:54 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
Really there is nothing to wiggle out of. I spoke of size and composition. Networks are losing audience. Also, you compare to networks you are comparing apples and oranges. Network news is on for a short time while news networks are on all day.
 
Compared with its peers Fox is fair and balanced,.
 
And you were wrong about its being a good point, The point was not well thought out. I would have been embarrassed to made an argument that was that bad.
August 6, 2008, 6:21:17 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
NVH,
 
Doesn't show any such thing. It also shows that people who use the internet have a lower opinion of mainstream news. It also shows that younger and more educated people have a lower opinion of network news.
 
So what?
 
No need to post the link again. We have already been through it in detail. You are flogging a dead horse.
 
I might be interested in your going back ot our previous discussion and attempt to refute my rebuttal. I mean actually come up with something new to say on the subject But even that would be a little tedious and probably try Johnny's patience.
 
I say give it up, I have already refuted your arguments. Go on to something else.
August 6, 2008, 6:27:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
nvy, by all means, repost the Pew data, but you're still going to have a problem demonstrating how the Democrats watching FNC are old KKK members, as much as we trust your hypotheses.
August 6, 2008, 6:27:06 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
No he's not going to post it again, because it's been posted already, and has been gone around and around long enough. Besides, posting what "Republicans" think about "the media" is just trying to sneak politics into what is supposed to be a discussion about cable news. I just nuked a couple of messages that went there. So the answer is: no, don't post it again. Talk about something else.
August 6, 2008, 6:29:36 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
"FNC are old KKK members,"
 
That's all the rage at newsliars. Pick any thread.
August 6, 2008, 6:36:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Well, you call the shots, Johnny...but it is interesting that nvh has Democrats divided into two camps: His and Lester Maddox's.
August 6, 2008, 6:37:03 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
All the networks are "fair and balanced" also....Wriggle out of that one. 
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 6:20 pm | # 
 
Msnbc being the least, by far!
August 6, 2008, 6:37:54 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Msnbc being the least, by far!
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 6:42 pm |
 
OS, I wholehearted disagree...I think you know my answer.
August 6, 2008, 6:45:02 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
I was using your logic, patsy. :lol:
August 6, 2008, 6:48:14 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 6:53 pm |
 
OS...Keiths well over a million viewers a night...That qualifies for fair and balanced recognition in my book.
August 6, 2008, 6:52:25 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
I think it's a safe bet Jack (CNN) wont be seen sipping cocktails in the Chinese Hilton.
August 6, 2008, 6:56:22 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
If a young audience is what a network seek, take a hint from the success of Stewart and Colbert. Of course, one has to be somewhat informed to even get their humor, but they are both more insightful, and much better comedians, than Hannity or Olbermann.
 
---
 
Yesterday, Cecelia won the prize for the most articulate, insightful post. It is yours today, nvh. Congratulations.
August 6, 2008, 7:07:51 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I am proud of Jack and CNN, HF. Far more guts than most of our national leaders and the other cable and broadcast networks ....
August 6, 2008, 7:19:22 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Of course, one has to be somewhat informed to even get their humor, but they are both more insightful,
 
by nvh
 
You actually think all the young people weeping and fainting at obama rally's have a clue what he's talking about? :lol:
August 6, 2008, 7:20:52 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Mark | 08.06.08 - 7:24 pm |
 
I'm 100% behind him as well...As long as it was the leaders he was talking about and not the Chinese people.
August 6, 2008, 7:21:40 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
OS...Keiths well over a million viewers a night...That qualifies for fair and balanced recognition in my book.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 6:57 pm | # 
 
You don't even understand your own logic, do you? "Well over a million a nigt." Really? Another lie.
August 6, 2008, 7:23:52 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
But you ignore composition. The ratio between democrats and Republicans is terrible. Also Fox has both numbers and composition.
 
Mark,
 
If that is your idea of an articulate insightful post, I see why so many of your posts are the way they are.
 
NVH's posts (su amigo? your alternate identity?) aren't really in the same league as Cecelia's. That is really an insult to her.
August 6, 2008, 7:25:36 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
You don't even understand your own logic, do you?
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 7:28 pm |
 
After a couple of European owned Budweiser it all gets a bit hazy...Joke...But please remind me of my logic.
August 6, 2008, 7:30:19 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
8PM - P2+ (25-54)
The O’Reilly Factor- 2,470,000 viewers (487,000)
CNN Election Center– 552,000 viewers (208,000)
Countdown w. Olbermann – 1,094,000 viewers (318,000)
The Suze Orman Show -244,000 viewers (53,000)
Nancy Grace – 795,000 viewers (338,000)
 
"Well over!" Pummelled by Nancy Grace. :lol: Thanks, patsy!
August 6, 2008, 7:34:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
You said, but it was deleted, that the "higer the ratings, te more fair ad balanced" and used jon stewart as an example. Hence, msnbc would be the least fair and balanced, by your logic, flawed as it is.
August 6, 2008, 7:36:37 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Pummelled by Nancy Grace.
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 7:39 pm | 
 
Keith 1,094,000 against Nancy 795,000
 
Going by your logic the Patriots won the Super Bowl....Wriggle away
August 6, 2008, 7:40:57 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
"higer the ratings, te more fair ad balanced"
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 7:41 pm |
 
I never said that...I think Danny? originally brought it up.
August 6, 2008, 7:47:13 PM EDT – Like – Reply


tony
Olby sucks: now you know that the demo numbers only count when they are in Olbermans favor. Whats the matter with you/
August 6, 2008, 7:47:27 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
The numbers also go against NVH/MARK's (they almost seem the same) argument that Olbermann is less obnoxious to younger people. Both nance and BOR beat Olby on the demographic; that is younger people.
August 6, 2008, 7:49:37 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,,
 
Must have been you. It is not what I said. I added something else. You were the one who has consistently ONLY considered size,.
August 6, 2008, 7:53:13 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Danny | 08.06.08 - 7:58 pm |
 
Not me...I think the idea is ridiculous....That's why I posted the Daily Show numbers(deleted now) to show how ridiculous it is.
August 6, 2008, 7:56:24 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
But size AND composition is not,.
August 6, 2008, 7:57:22 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
Since you did not consider the totality of what I said, you never refuted my argument.
 
This may be what OS was hinting at when he suggested that your logic is like the peace of God in that it is beyond all understanding.
 
If it were possible to explain your logic (at least the logic you have just demonstrated) then it would not be your logic.,
August 6, 2008, 8:00:18 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
The HD complicates article didn't really match the title, but that's OK- the story itself claims that there are "bugs" introduced with the editing which isn't really substantiated in itself.
 
It also mentions distorted images but gives no examples in the writeup or the video. Apparently, choosing the aspect ratio is a bug to that reporter... 
 
HD isn't difficult. It's higher resolution with 16:9 aspect ratio instead of 4:3. You select the recording format in the editing software and poof- it's done.
August 6, 2008, 8:00:48 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Danny | 08.06.08 - 8:05 pm |
 
Danny, the size AND composition of an audience doesn't mean a programme is fair and balanced.
August 6, 2008, 8:06:00 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
NVH's posts (su amigo? your alternate identity?) 
 
---
 
Perhaps, we picked the winner too early. How clever you are, Danny to realize there couldn't be more than one person in the world who might not share your opinions.
August 6, 2008, 8:09:56 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
More proof...If needed.
 
FOXNews Flips Heckler Story, Says Obama SKIPPED Pledge Of Allegiance
 
[link deleted]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 8:11:52 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
You continue to demonstrate a logic that is beyond understanding.
 
Obviously it's a good indicator. People tend to watch what appeals to them. Children watch the Comedy channel. Music loving teenagers watch the music channels etc, etc. The indicator has extremely good face validity.
 
The burden of proof is on you to show why people are watching what does not appeal to them.
 
Normally that does not happen.
 
If you want to argue that MSNBC is more fair and balanced then the burden of proof is on you to show why it does not appeal to more politically diverse populations.
 
Doubt that you can do it but you are welcome to try.
August 6, 2008, 8:15:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Danny | 08.06.08 - 8:20 pm |
Danny....Limbaugh gets huge ratings....Is he fair and balanced?
August 6, 2008, 8:19:50 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
I think you are going off topic again. No way I could reply without discussing whether it is valid to criticize Obama not demonstrating patriotism.
 
This is old news and off topic, and I think you know it.
 
You are also changing the subject.
 
Why are you being obnoxious?
August 6, 2008, 8:19:57 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
Haggis, I've warned you about posting your links. This is the 3rd or 4th one today. If you don't limit yourself I will.
 
It's only aggravated by your lie that fox "flipped" the story into obama "skipping" the pledge. In fact, I have audio of the town hall exchange. Obama HIMSELF said we didn't do the pledge. He then agreed to say it to make up for not having said it earlier.
 
You're hogging this thread with your multiple links. Strike one. You're then lying about fox news. Strike two. One more strike and your next stay at Exile Island will be your longest.
August 6, 2008, 8:21:42 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
There you go again. You are just looking at size.
 
Is this supposed to be another illustration of the logic OS was talking about?
August 6, 2008, 8:21:50 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
This is old news
Danny | 08.06.08 - 8:24 pm |
 
It only happened this morning on F&F....Not that old
August 6, 2008, 8:22:28 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 8:27 pm |
 
Going for another strike?
August 6, 2008, 8:24:37 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
[message deleted for rules violation: off-topic. McCain's campaign events are irrelevant]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 8:28:07 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
H'F,
 
YOu are still changing the subject; you are still off topic; you are still trying to provoke a political discussion , when you know better. And . . . you are still being obnoxious.
August 6, 2008, 8:30:42 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Thank you Ellen Brodsky.
 
No, I am not accusing you of being Ellen's sockpuppet, But, I definitely accuse you of being Ellen's agent. I do this since Ellen has IN PRINT encouraged her followers to come to this site and be as rude and disruptive as possible,
 
People all over the net shojuld know of Ellen's character and her pattern of harassing other sites,.
 
I am thinking of writing her internet provider to close Newshounds down,
August 6, 2008, 8:35:37 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Danny | 08.06.08 - 8:35 pm |
 
Danny, I think to be on the safe side...We'd better call it a draw...I can see the finger hovering over that strike button.
August 6, 2008, 8:37:30 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
I was away from this comment thread for five hours. For the third day in a row, it has devolved into chaos. So much for whatever was going to be implemented earlier today. I'm a broken record, but all you people want to do is fight and attack. Why? I'm not directing this at HF, Mark, or NVH.
August 6, 2008, 8:39:13 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
I see haggis/patsy got the "heckler" lie from the newsliars.
August 6, 2008, 8:39:32 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
And to be on topic, TVByTheNumbers now includes the 35-64 demographic.
August 6, 2008, 8:39:48 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
Your wanting to call it a draw is a little like the Patriots asking for a draw just before time ran out in the Superbowl (hope you understand the analogy since it was yours to begin with).
August 6, 2008, 8:40:03 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
[message deleted: reply to deleted comment]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 8:46:10 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
One civil commenter that doesn't play the challenge/response game going elsewhere. (I'm leaving, goodbye.)
August 6, 2008, 8:46:48 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Danny | 08.06.08 - 8:40 pm |
 
Ellen came over very well, the other day, on the Mike Gallagher show.
August 6, 2008, 8:46:51 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I am thinking of writing her internet provider to close Newshounds down,
Danny | 08.06.08 - 8:40 pm | # 
---
Good for you, Danny. I have been thinking about writing the Chamber of Commerce to close Wal-Mart down. I'll be pleased to proof your letter, although I can't imagine there would be a mistake in it, if you'll proof mine, which will undoubtedly be filled with factual errors and deplorable grammar and syntax.
August 6, 2008, 8:49:08 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
> all you people want to do is fight and attack. Why?
 
Because they have a visceral reaction to bullies and liars. So do I. It would be nice if people didn't jump at every bit of planned provocation, but even I am guilty of not being able to resist at times.
 
> I'm not directing this at HF, Mark, or NVH.
 
That's a puzzler.
August 6, 2008, 8:49:32 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Fat people watching the food channel and Republicans watching the golf channel does not contain much face validity.
 
Mexicans watching Univision contains great face validity. I'd like you to prove that Univsion audience is not heavily slanted towards Mexican or Spanish speaking people.
 
Of course I am generalizing, which is what statisticians do. Of course, there are some non Spanish speaking people who watch Univision, but that is generally not the case.
 
There are some Republicans who watch MSNBC (the numbers show that), but not so many. If that is not an indicator that MSNBC is not doing much to appeal to that section of the audience, I don't know what is,
August 6, 2008, 8:53:35 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I'm not directing this at HF, Mark, or NVH.
 
That's a puzzler.
 
---
 
Not really. I have never noticed Mike threatened by differing opinions. He shares his views and lets others share their views.
 
But, your point about jumping at planned provocation is true. It is a regrettable human characteristic. I know Monday night was awful here. My own sense is that we ought to focus a bit more on controlling the nastiness and be a little bit less concerned about the "on topic" issue which is, at best, subjective and at times whimsical.
August 6, 2008, 8:55:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
[reply to deleted comment]

Edited By Siteowner
August 6, 2008, 8:55:07 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I'd respond, Danny, but you're replying to a deleted post which was deleted for replying to a deleted post, and that just wouldn't be right
August 6, 2008, 8:56:57 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
Of course you realize that Ellen started the whole thing. I was just aping her. And Ellen had a lot less provocation.
 
Maybe you'd better Ellen Brodsky proof your letter. She would be more sympathetic anyway. I like Wal Mart. Don't know what I would do without it.
August 6, 2008, 8:57:14 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Bingo on Cavuto.
August 6, 2008, 8:57:35 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
HF,
 
I understand why you liked the argument. Your logic is shining through again,
August 6, 2008, 9:00:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Cavuto would also have to go.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 9:00 pm | #
 
Have Cavuto's words ever killed anyone?
August 6, 2008, 9:01:36 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I don't want to get into the Ellen deal, Danny. There is only one person at this site with whom I have a serious, on-going complaint, and he is rather inconsequential. In other words, it is not you. Johnny and you are certainly free to belittle Ellen. It's not my fight, and I have told Johnny he is merely calling attention to her. Attention she doesn't warrant. No one respects her work, and no one takes her seriously. I understand the underlying impulse, however.
August 6, 2008, 9:01:39 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
That's a puzzler.
johnny dollar | Homepage | 08.06.08 - 8:54 pm |
 
Why is that J$?....Mark/NVH/Me are all talking about cable news...Just a different viewpoint.
August 6, 2008, 9:01:58 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
Thanks, Pat$y!
 
Although you have cleaned up your language to a power of 10 here I don't think J$ is going to let the very much watered down version fly.
August 6, 2008, 9:02:49 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
In light of the other 9:06 post, I really, really understand the impulse, Danny.
August 6, 2008, 9:03:02 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
No one respects her work, and no one takes her seriously. I understand the underlying impulse, however.
Mark | 08.06.08 - 9:06 pm | # 
 
I have a feelng haggis/patsy will beg to differ.
August 6, 2008, 9:04:15 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Grammie, jekyl and hyde is a better description.
August 6, 2008, 9:05:47 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
If you understand, maybe you will strive at least to attempt to link your posts to some issue relating to cable news and to be be less off topic and to be less obnoxious.
 
Also you might consider quit repeating arguments over and over again when they have been rebutted.
August 6, 2008, 9:08:02 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
> No one respects her work, and no one takes her seriously.
 
Haggis does. Apparently being caught in hundreds of lies consitutes doing a great service to some people.
August 6, 2008, 9:08:16 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
johnny dollar | Homepage | 08.06.08 - 9:13 pm |
 
I haven't a clue what your talking about.
August 6, 2008, 9:10:53 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
I believe he's speaking of your post some days back that the NHs do a great service.
August 6, 2008, 9:12:11 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Fox Fan | 08.06.08 - 9:17 pm |
 
They do...But I don't take what is said there or on any other blog as gospel.
August 6, 2008, 9:14:31 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
I believe that they perform a harmful disservice to society through dissemination of lies, groupthink, and targeted censorship.
 
Please don't take it personally, just a disagreement.
August 6, 2008, 9:16:53 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Keep in mind, Danny, rebuttal is a type of argument. It is not proof. It does not necessarily end a matter. The distinction is important.
August 6, 2008, 9:17:11 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Then why do you worship olbermann when his comedy show is ripped right off the blogs you link to as proof 50 times a day?
August 6, 2008, 9:17:24 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 9:17 pm |
 
Always attacking...Never anything sensible...Give us a treat OS for once.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 9:22 pm | # 
 
That post was right "on the mark."
August 6, 2008, 9:18:51 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Fox Fan | 08.06.08 - 9:21 pm |
 
FF...I totally respect your views...You could say the same about most political/media blogs that take sides.
August 6, 2008, 9:19:39 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
Not really, Haggis. The difference between one that does a great service and one that doesn't is the level of honesty at said political/media blog.
August 6, 2008, 9:21:03 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
...You could say the same about most political/media blogs that take sides.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 9:24 pm | # 
 
Take a stab.
August 6, 2008, 9:22:24 PM EDT – Like – Reply


david smawley
45% of the people who are FoxNews fans do not favor John Gibson over the other choices on this poll. Sorry, it does not reflect accurate feedback and the results are bogus. Just my opinion and I am sticking to it. He will not be back as permanent 5pm host, I like him, but no dice.
August 6, 2008, 9:27:15 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Fox Fan | 08.06.08 - 9:26 pm |
 
That's very true...But we all know the truth. at times, get severely stretched on left/right leaning blogs.
August 6, 2008, 9:28:11 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 9:33 pm | #
 
Can't disagree with that, Haggis. I am a bit surprised that you don't recognize the blatant falsifications and vitriol that occur at NHs however. It just isn't doing a great service to anything.
August 6, 2008, 9:40:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
NVH's posts (su amigo? your alternate identity?) aren't really in the same league as Cecelia's. That is really an insult to her.
Danny | 08.06.08 - 7:30 pm | # 
 
aaawwww... it's just a matter of who's useful to him at any given moment.
August 6, 2008, 9:44:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
blatant falsifications
Fox Fan | 08.06.08 - 9:45 pm |
 
If that happens it's wrong...Sadly we don't live in a perfect world.
August 6, 2008, 9:54:19 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Chromium
I am surprised that the NBC group is using the word "Decision" on their dashboard, with the now well-established "Indecision" mockery continuing as "Indecision 2008" on Comedy Central.
August 6, 2008, 10:01:28 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
Well, there have been hundreds of proofs of the blatant falsifications, there's no "if" about it. It IS wrong.
 
That said, if I'm ever in the UK I'll buy you a tall Old Peculier. (spelling intentional)
August 6, 2008, 10:02:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Can't disagree with that, Haggis. I am a bit surprised that you don't recognize the blatant falsifications and vitriol that occur at NHs however. It just isn't doing a great service to anything.
Fox Fan | 08.06.08 - 9:45 pm | # 
 
Well, goodness... FF, it's because he shares the News Hounds sentiments...duh...
 
Supposedly, he's British and he frequents the News Hounds blog and a "Your source for the truth about Fox News" blog...and....on his telly he gets CNN and FNC and he likes CNN...
 
And you're "surprised"?...
August 6, 2008, 10:02:30 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
Yes, Cece, he seems smart enough to see that they aren't a credible site. 
 
No surprise with your comment, which belittles both him and me. Thanks for your input.
August 6, 2008, 10:11:39 PM EDT – Like – Reply


HaggisFarmer
Fox Fan | 08.06.08 - 10:07 pm |
 
Yes it's wrong and I can't defend it....But the same also happens on right wing blogs.
 
I'd be happy to take you up on that offer...Someone who likes real ale is a top chap in my book.
August 6, 2008, 10:17:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Let's just say I'm surprised. You seem MORE than a smart enough chap, FF.
August 6, 2008, 10:25:32 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
I'm a smart enough chap to realize who is insulting me and who isn't, Cecelia.
August 6, 2008, 10:51:10 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
If that happens it's wrong...Sadly we don't live in a perfect world.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 9:59 pm | # 
 
Proof positve there is NO defending the indefensible.....
August 6, 2008, 10:53:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
...You could say the same about most political/media blogs that take sides.
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 9:24 pm | # 
 
Take a stab.
olby sucks | 08.06.08 - 9:27 pm | # 
 
Yes it's wrong and I can't defend it....But the same also happens on right wing blogs.
 
I'd be happy to take you up on that offer...
HaggisFarmer | 08.06.08 - 10:22 pm | # 
 
Really? Why did you avoid it earlier?
August 6, 2008, 10:58:15 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
[I'm just now returning]
 
It is true that a rebuttal need not be the end of a discussion. But that goes for the original argument as well. 
 
This brings us to the point I have been trying to get across to you . . . but for some reason you haven't quite comprehended it yet. In most cases, if you don't rebut the rebuttal the original rebuttal stands. Your argument is not only rebutted, it stands refuted as well.
 
It is very gauche (not to mention obnoxious) for you to continue repeating your original argument (an argument that stands rebutted and refuted) without even mentioning the counter argument. 
 
Capish?
August 7, 2008, 4:32:48 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I guess I'm just every bit as stupid and as gauche as you tell me I am, ad nauseum. Keep up the good work, though, Danny. Who knows? There is a possibility, admittedly slight, it will somehow seek in through this dense mass above my shoulders. As always, I am in your debt.
August 7, 2008, 7:59:21 AM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
"Politics plays a large part in these assessments – Republicans outnumber Democrats by two-to-one (43% to 21%) among the core Fox News Channel audience, while there are far more Democrats than Republicans among CNN's viewers (43% Democrat, 22% Republican) and network news viewers (41% Democrat, 24% Republican)."
 
Now according to Pew, the Fox percentages of Democrats to Republicans is not significantly different than CNN's percentages of Democrats to Republicans. Taken at face value,these numbers show that the simplistic proof that Fox is fair and balanced BECAUSE of the number of Democrats in their audience doesn't hold water. However, it does indisputably show that there are many more Republicans who watch Fox for news than Democrats.
August 7, 2008, 9:49:32 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Interesting analysis of viewership, nvh. 
 
I will say I am not troubled in the least by this, and I am not troubled by FNC airing a conservative perspective or MSNBC a more liberal one. I am amused by those who tenaciously cling to the marketing slogans and sickened by the sanctimony of a few FNC personalities who perpetually decry and proclaim their fairness (much as I would be sickened by Olbermann delcaring his).
 
Maybe, after the election and inauguration, we can deal with all of this with a bit more honesty.
 
Thanks, again, for the anlysis.
August 7, 2008, 9:55:35 AM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
> Now according to Pew, the Fox percentages of Democrats to Republicans is not significantly different than CNN's percentages of Democrats to Republicans.
 
ALso according to Pew, more Democrats watch Fox News than either of the other two news channels, as I have demonstrated with documentary proof. You could at least have the courtesy to cite my brilliant, definitive, and Pulitzer-worthy analysis on this point! News channel audiences are becoming increasingly partisanized if that's a word as the election grows closer. MSNBC admits it is moving to the left; others are convinced by the constant stream of propaganda that Fox is 24 hours of GOP propaganda. So partisan viewers tend to migrate more and more as the election approaches. I expect you'll find the spread among viewers of all three channels widening until December, when things will settle down to normal.
 
Just a final note. The purpose of these threads is not to serve as a chat room, a debate forum, or the like. It is to comment on cable news developments, topical news, etc. The fact that I get emails every day from people who are sick of wading through all the back and forth bickering means that I am going to serve my readership by whatever means necessary.
August 7, 2008, 10:03:35 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
FF. I certainly didn't mean to insult you.
 
Forgive me. I'll try to be less caustic.
August 7, 2008, 10:50:07 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
The fact that I get emails every day from people who are sick of wading through all the back and forth bickering means that I am going to serve my readership by whatever means necessary.
 
---
 
Helpful to know, Johnny.
 
You obviously have three (3) classes of readers/participants:
 
1. Intensely political, intelligent, articulate people who have well-developed and deeply-held political and social philosophies.
 
2. Cable news gab and gossip sorts. It is almost impossible to say that in a manner that doesn't sound smug, judgmental, but it is a completely legitimate interest which needs to be respected.
 
3. A very, very small group of incendiary nincompoops.
 
I think everyone, except the members of Group 3, probably missing this discussion while holding a convention in a Porta-Potty in Peoria , recognizes your need to balance the first two (2) groups and the formidable task that is. While I am not one to fall at your feet to make the mound of praise heaped on you seem even higher, I recognize the difficulty, I applaud the sincere effort you make, and I astonishingly agree with the vast majority of your editorial decisions. You do a far better job than I would.
August 7, 2008, 11:20:44 AM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Which category did Mrs. Philby or Kip King fit in, mark? Just curious.
August 7, 2008, 11:54:14 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
There are many sites at which incendiary nincompoops are the majority, I am sure.
August 7, 2008, 12:09:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
Doesn't answer my question.
August 7, 2008, 12:18:44 PM EDT – Like – Reply


olby sucks
I didn't expect you too, either. I'll leave it at that.
August 7, 2008, 12:19:56 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark/NVH, 
 
Johnny's analysis leads me to wonder what the hell are you doing in this site. Obviously, you want to talk and argue politics. You are not primarily interested in cable news. I know that because you frequently go off topic and it is very difficult to keep you on topic. You get warned and warned and warned again . . . but it does not seem to do any good.
 
There are plenty of sites where you can argue politics to your hearts content and not break any rules.
 
Mark you have exhibited a great deal of phoniness in your time here. You put on an air of courtesy, when you are not a courteous person. We know that, given a free reign, you can say the most disgusting and discourteous things about people. Even bringing an fother poster's amily and "animal husbandry" into the discussion.
 
Your last post directed to me was totally phony. You don't want to thank me for what I said. You don't consider yourself in my debt. You don't consider yourself a stupid person. In fact, you consider yourself more intelligent and more insightful than any conservative. The arrogance you have exhibited here is so large that it is almost immeasurable.
 
I also don't believe that you have little to do with Newshounds or the Outfoxed production crew. I don't believe that you truly denounce them or Olbermann. You have been on the Olbermann site praising him. Earlier, you did everything you could do to disrupt a site that was critical of Olbermann . . . to the point of their having to change their posting policies. This you did because you like him so much.
 
John t, a Newshounds regular, said that he posts here to raise Hell. Is that your purpose as well? Is that why you post here rather than another site you would obviously be more comfortable and your postings would not break the rules? Do you want to attack this site the same way you previously attacked the Olbermann Watch site?
 
At any rate, let's be honest with one another. I really dislike your behavior. And I am certain you don't like me very much either. Your phony courtesy and sarcasm gets you nowhere with me. It only makes me respect your postings less . . . if that is possible. 
 
One suggestion: why don't you post here, at most, twice a day? All that you have to say that is important about cable news could be distilled into one or two posts. The rest of the time you could post in a forum that is about politics.
 
Oh yeah . . . I forgot. The reason you don't do that is because you want to raise hell here. You want to hog the threads. Driven by some warped political agenda, you want to attack this site and destroy it, if you can.
 
And you wonder why I intensely dislike your behavior and find it truly abysmal and abominable.
August 7, 2008, 1:31:45 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
Somehow, a simple "thanks," just doesn't seem enough. Keep the advice coming, please. There is no one's opinion I value more. 
 
With my sincerest and warmest regards,
August 7, 2008, 1:48:31 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Mark,
 
Your palpable phoniness, dishonesty, and arrogance just keep coming.
 
I really don't thank you for that.
 
See, honesty isn't really so hard. You should try it some time.
August 7, 2008, 1:53:40 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Vince
All this poilitical crap is why I dont bother talking much.
 
Plus getting people I dont know report what I'm doing from other sites that they are on too but under some other unknown name is a bunch of game playing that I find disturbing. A normal person would say "Hey. I"m so-and-so from the other blog".. but no. not these hyperpartisan , extremists.
August 7, 2008, 2:02:35 PM EDT – Like – Reply


notveryhow
"I don't believe that you truly denounce them or Olbermann."
 
What makes you think I want to convert?
August 7, 2008, 2:55:53 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
My guess, nvh, is that Danny naturally assumes that his highly effective rebuttal established the truth and unveiled it for all of the world to see. I, for one, can't argue with that, and I think you are being highly unappreciative.
August 7, 2008, 3:32:10 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
NVH,
 
Mark has denounced both Olbermann and Newshounds on this site. Obviously that part of my post was directed specifically at Mark.
 
I do have my suspicions concerning the relationship between you and Mark, but since I can't prove them, I won't directly make the accusation.
 
As usual, Mark, your guess is both stupid and wrong. Why you want to continue to reveal your dishonesty make a fool of yourself in the process is beyond me.
August 7, 2008, 3:40:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
OK, let's all switch to decaf and knock off the personal tit-for-tats. Argue issues, not people.
August 7, 2008, 3:45:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


sharm
Danny,
 
I don't know if you'll see this or if Johnny will indulge me, but I'll try. Before the great purge at OW, Robert Cox was very lenient with the political discussions. Johnny moderated according to Bob's direction. Johnny would have cut off many discussions outside of the sphere of Olbermann but respected Bob's wishes and very seldom banned comments. I was a regular commenter on and off for a year and a half or so as were some others here on this site.
 
You are correct in your analysis of Mark (known as Clucker et al on OW). He can be as charming as he wants to be and if you saw only a few of his comments, you would think it rather intolerant to jump on his case. You have obviously seen through the veneer. We were often given free reign at OW for extended discussions way off topic, much to Johnny's, rightful as it turned out, irritation. BTW, the sock puppet Ted Nugent (initially Laura Bush) was a foul mouthed character spouting "right wing propoganda." Phony Soldier was another. Eventually over 10,000 comments were deleted, which sums up the fate of OW. I haven't done the research of the archives, but I would guess that the comments here started to spike right about the time that OW was in the process of a changeover, or when it was clear that it was about to occur.
 
You are a much better opponent than I ever was. I was naive for a very long time.
August 7, 2008, 8:14:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


sharm
I do want to add that there are good people over at OW now. It's worth going over now and then to comment there.
August 7, 2008, 8:15:56 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I shall abide by Johnny's wishes and not devolve into the tit-for-tat so desired by some of my fellow posters. In any event, different ideas have never threatened me. I welcome them as gifts of the free will with which we were endowed. My thanks for sharing so graciously.
August 7, 2008, 8:31:08 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Sham,
 
thanks for your honesty
 
Mark,
 
Sure. I just love it when you grace my table with still another helping of sugary phoniness.
August 7, 2008, 8:54:53 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mark
I am pleased I could in some small measure recompense you for your grace and sound-advice, Danny.
August 7, 2008, 8:56:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Sugary phoniness, Yep Mark you got it down pat,
August 7, 2008, 9:04:36 PM EDT – Like – Reply


sharm
I hope that "sham" is a typo! Sharm is my nickname. When I first commented here, that was my default name. I didn't bother to change it to Sharon.
August 7, 2008, 9:05:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Danny
Sorry Sharm,
 
Was a typo. thanks was genuine.
August 7, 2008, 9:14:08 PM EDT – Like – Reply