12/19/09 11:27 AM

Tuesday Links and Open Thread

Latest cable news links [updated through the day]:

Baier media room dedicated.

Video: secrets of the cube revealed!

MSNBC lifts graphic from Kos?!?

Weekend numbers.

Cranky Nasty Biz Correspondents?

Video: Santelli vs Liesman.

JD: Day two. Q&A: Liz McDonald.

MSNBC's infomercial. Hotline after dark.

Hayes to FNC? Keilar hitched. CNN's gets.

Use our valuable bandwidth to post your cable news comments in today's open thread. Standard rules apply.




Mike C.
Stephen Hayes is a Weekly Standard guy. So, I guess he's taking over for Fred Barnes...?
May 5, 2009, 1:33:47 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Blackflon
It looks like Ellen got a little smackdown by one of her own.
 
Interestingly, she still can't see that she and ahe alone was responsible.
=========================
Ellen,  
 
Can you really not see that you are in a special and privileged position?  
 
What you will is law on this board. And some posters gained the impression that what you willed was for them to attack the J$ board, relentlessly.  
 
What is worse, is that because they thought they were doing your bidding, they saw themselves as the chosen few, and so treated the bulk of the board who did not join in their folly as being less faithful to the Newshounds than they. Which is why the treated us with the same contempt that they expressed on Johnny Dollar  
 
You did that. You created this whole schism in what was an otherwise harmonious board  
 
Yes, of course you can express your views, whatever they are. But on this issue, you are abusing your position as a mod, and I cannot express enough how much admiration I have for those who have the courage to stand up and tell you so.......  
 
I just wish you were listening.  
posted by: UKLibDem on Tue 5.5 1:42am  
 
UKLibDem,  
 
I'm listening but I don't see it your way. I wish you could listen to my point of view.  
 
In any event, I think it's rather unfair of you to say that I created a schism. I mean, come on, we're talking about one thread that has been deleted. With all due respect, I think you are blowing this up out of proportion.  
Posted by: Ellen on Tue 5.5 1:47am
 
Now she has her own "Let's talk" thread where only she is allowed to post.
May 5, 2009, 8:12:24 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Blackflon
WOW!! Is this gonna piss off the haters!
 
http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2009/05/04/the_future_of_talk_radio/?page=full
 
Q: Who are some of those wonderful radio people?
 
A: Sean Hannity is one of the nicest people in the world. And Alan Colmes, his former partner, is one of the finest people I've ever known. One is considered an arch-conservative and one is liberal, but they're both really standup guys. I judge people by how they go out of their way to help their fellow broadcaster. Jim Bohannon, who's nationally syndicated by Westwood One, is wonderful. Dr. Laura Schlessinger, who is very controversial, is personally a really caring, deeply humane person - which is interesting, because her reputation is the opposite.

Edited By Siteowner
May 5, 2009, 10:03:54 AM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
Ellen is on a vendetta, she wont listen to truth/reason. And will dismiss anyone that does . I was on the anit $ thread before it got deleted, and refused to attack $, and because I refused to play, ellen banned me.  
I'm sure the posters acted like the victim and had me banned.
May 5, 2009, 10:16:06 AM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
For a site that likes to claim, they "watch" fox so we dont have to, they like to attack the opinioned shows alot.
May 5, 2009, 10:26:38 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
Black, I must say that overall I have been pretty impressed with UKLib. He seems to be fairly level headed and I have never noticed him being gratuitously arrogant and profanely insulting to others. In fact there are times I've wished I could engage him.
 
Having said all that this also struck me when I read it last night:
 
---------------------------------------
"....they were doing your bidding, they saw themselves as the chosen few, and so treated the bulk of the board who did not join in their folly as being less faithful to the Newshounds than they. Which is why the (SIC) treated us with the same contempt that they expressed on Johnny Dollar ......"
---------------------------------------------
 
He shares that same trait with the rest of them. Anything directed at Dollar and his Dollarites is fine as long as a pup doesn't heap the same same profane dirt on another pup.
 
Although UKLib doesn't express it here I'm pretty sure he also has that other common Kennel trait. We shouldn't allow that b/c that is what Dollar and his Dollarites do and we're much better than they are and besides it reflects badly on we more genteel mutts.
 
I'm starting to think that to be a mutt in good standing a doctor has to first certify that they have that huge blind spot.
May 5, 2009, 10:39:57 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
" Stephen Hayes is a Weekly Standard guy. So, I guess he's taking over for Fred Barnes...?
Mike C. | Homepage | 05.05.09 - 1:38 am | # "
 
I can't place Hayes so I have no opinion of him one way ot the other.
 
Mike, I thought Barnes and Kondracke were going to continue as FNC as analysts/contributors. Or do you think that info was just to ease the transition away from The Boys?
May 5, 2009, 10:54:22 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Blackflon
Another example of Ellen's disengenousness.
 
On one of Fox's saturday morning financial programs made the remark, “You've had 12 people die, period!” Layfield said “36,000 died last year from the flu, the regular flu.”
 
Ellen was not pleased and said "Think he'd be so cavalier if one of those 12 people were his wife?"
 
I wonder what Ellen thinks about all the other folks on the other networks who said the exact same thing?
 
The hate for Fox just never ends.
May 5, 2009, 12:04:58 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
I was just raising a question, Grammie. We'll see what role Hayes ends up playing on future panels or whatever shows he appears on.
May 5, 2009, 12:28:27 PM EDT – Like – Reply


cee
The chickaboomer story gives me another reason to avoid NBC NEWS' coverage of anything political.
 
Between trying to resurrect their poor network ratings and GE's multiple interests in government contracts, NBC is just chock full or conflicts of interest.
 
Any ethical jounalists left should either be more vocal of these conflicts, show some independence and objectivity, or look for better pastures.
 
Colleagues like Olbermann, Matthews, Shuster and Maddow are really fouling the field as well.
May 5, 2009, 1:20:51 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
So I have seen some attacks on foxnews recently and have said nothing here , because this thought struck me, The media is going after fox news because how they cover obama, but is it a double standard? Because of the way they went after bush( the rest of the media)? Meaning if your going to attack fox news for something, atleast be fair and attack the rest of the media? not just foxnews (hannity will edit things to make obama look bad, he has cause I have seen it, but didnt say K.O. edit things to make bush look bad? and not just K.O. the rest of the media?
 
I criticzed foxnews 2 weeks ago about a fox and friends clip that i saw on media matters, brough it here and i was disagreed with. Now looking back at it
 
Axlerod: dissent unhealthy (clip)
guest on fox news: no it isnt
 
Two sides-Now ISNT that fair and balanced?? (thats rich coming from someone saying the channel isnt, but I had time to think)
 
I think I have fallen into the same trap as anyone else when it has come to fox news.
 
If I am wrong, Let me know (or right)
 
NBC News has been giving a bad name because of the antics of MSNBC.
May 5, 2009, 2:04:03 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
Selena Roberts, New York Times reporter and author of an Alex Rodriguez biography, was on "Fox & Friends" today, including the After the Show Show. I hope that doesn't lead to attacks on Fox from certain sports talk radio personalities, particularly here in NYC on WFAN-AM. Or for that matter, I hope callers don't attack Fox, either.
May 5, 2009, 4:01:54 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
I have created a forum. here is the link:
 
http://chrisg1981.forumotion.com/index.htm
 
future ones will be done in the the url below.
May 5, 2009, 4:05:53 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
Actually, I think she was on the After the Show Show and the main interview will air on the weekend.
May 5, 2009, 4:06:46 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
In last night's Message for Greg segment on "Red Eye," images of Dom DeLuise were used while voicemails on Greg Gutfeld's direct line were played. By an odd coincidence, DeLuise died last night at the age of 75. I'm not blaming one for the other; I'm just pointing out the coincidence. My condolences to his family and friends, including Burt Reynolds, who broke the news.
May 5, 2009, 4:12:57 PM EDT – Like – Reply


cee
Not only does MSNBC get their editorial guidance from the nutroots....
 
They are starting to get their graphics from the radical bloggers as well....
 
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/5/5/727882/-The-Goposaur-hits-the-big-time
 
###
Clever, that dinosaur icon, ripped right from Keith Olbermann's favorite site.
 
MSNBC is getting more pathetic by the day.
May 5, 2009, 4:36:41 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
I didn't know that Hayes was working for CNN.
 
In the past I've always seen him as a guest on Hardball. He guested there recently, in fact. I suppose he was in between gigs.
 
I like him. He's obviously a conservative/libertarian, but he's not a rah!...rah!... my team!... ideologue.  
 
He's interested in politics and issues and can frankly critique plays from either side (wow...for someone who couldn't tell you the rules of any sport, I'm am using the sports analogies today...) and can talk about the issues from all perspectives.
May 5, 2009, 4:42:07 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
That was a good catch. Worthy of a link posting. Thanks!
May 5, 2009, 4:43:56 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Cee,
 
It's certainly interesting that some at MSNBC have been vehemently declaring the extinction of the Republican Party.
 
To his credit, Chris Matthews recognizes that it took a very unpopular war and a economic collapse to bring about what is undeniably a transcendent Democratic Party, and a marginalized Republican one.  
 
Matthews acknowledges that this has been a "perfect storm" sort of scenario that could change come next election.
 
David Shuster and Norah O'Donnell may be pleasing the Kos Kids with the political obituaries, but the analysis they're offering is pretty simplistic, to say the least.
May 5, 2009, 4:51:49 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
naw not msnbc, just countdown, but then again..
 
countdown should be called the blue blog news with Keith Olbermann. Isnt every story from the blue blogs anyway?
May 5, 2009, 4:57:46 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
Your 'homepage' link isn't working, Chris, because you put an abbreviated version of it in. Make sure you put the full URL in that box (or use tinyurl if you want to make it shorter).
May 5, 2009, 5:02:32 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
UKLib, is certainly stating the obvious, Blackflon.
 
I'm not quite sure why Ellen can't formerly take on "the lies and distortions of Johnny Dollar" from the main board. In insisting that the now moderated thread in the unmoderated forum continue....sheesh!... she continues to want to have her cake and eat it too.  
 
She wanted a place where Johnny and we posters here, could be insulted and impugned in a way that would be inappropriate for the rules of the "Mains", but she didn't bank on how out of control Patrick and Patsy would get.  
 
She'd have enjoyed their using the c-word as "c@@@" and insults about us being on our knees, what she got was such rampant homophobia and sexism that it horrified the rest of the NHers.
 
Anyway, there are certainly some good folks at News Hounds. Paul is utterly delightful and cracks me up, and Captain America and Nipigon (I know I'm misspelling it), are rational souls too.
 
We may not share the same tastes in politics or cable viewing, but I wish them all the best.
May 5, 2009, 5:09:27 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
oops!! thanks oops!! thanks $ I corrected itnbsp;
 
I corrected it
May 5, 2009, 5:33:23 PM EDT – Like – Reply


cee
The kos post about the dinosaur is high on Shuster subbing for Olbermann.....Perhaps the next Maddow.
 
His last show, 1600 PENNSYLVANIA AVENUE was just cancelled recently.
I suppose the diarist was not a big viewer.
 
Regarding the MSNBC children predicting that The GOP is headed for the tar pits, Cec, a credible opinion, born from a much more valuable perspective, can be found here.....
 
http://tinyurl.com/cvhhnb
 
###
Prehaps Olbermann or Shuster can invite the former Republican Senator to come on COUNTDOWN for a useful, alternative perspective?
May 5, 2009, 5:36:05 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
Cecelia,
 
because there are no "lies"  
 
I talked to paul, and nip when i was allowed to talk there (i'm banned there now) they were good to talk to
May 5, 2009, 5:36:12 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
oops, I meant that I don't know why Ellen can't formallytake on...
May 5, 2009, 5:37:02 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Blackflon
Within his goal of defending Fox News, News Hounds is right in his path. So as long as JB$ or News Hounds is around, JB$ is not going to quit bitching about News Hounds.  
Posted by: AAP on Tue 5.5 3:25pm  
 
What is it with this crowd? Why do they get so upset when someone does exactly what they themselves choose to do?
May 5, 2009, 5:47:01 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
6pm ed schultz?, his ratings are pathetic
they should have kept what they had.
May 5, 2009, 6:04:22 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Chris, I think it was the usual scenario of disagreement with the regulars over FNC or Johnny, leading to a morass of self-defenses, etc, culminating in being accused of thread-jacking.
 
Your tenure there longer than Grammie and I did.  
 
It's Ellen's salon and she can tolerate whom she wishes.
 
It's interesting that with all AAP's denunciations of Bob Cox, he was allowed to post at OW in full psychotic mode for YEARS.
May 5, 2009, 6:04:57 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
blackfon,
 
because they have double standards as for
 
News Hounds is right in his path  
Posted by: AAP on Tue 5.5 3:25pm
 
lying is the right path?? how about telling the truth or saying fox news is saying the same things as the other media?
May 5, 2009, 6:09:54 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Within his goal of defending Fox News, News Hounds is right in his path. So as long as JB$ or News Hounds is around, JB$ is not going to quit bitching about News Hounds.
Posted by: AAP on Tue 5.5 3:25pm
 
What is it with this crowd? Why do they get so upset when someone does exactly what they themselves choose to do?
Blackflon | Homepage | 05.05.09 - 5:52 pm | #  
 
Awwww... this is just Patsy's way of trying to persuade everyone that he's needed in order to be their hit man...their "muscle".
 
They'd be better served by the people there who are muscular in the brain dept., but Ellen decidedly wants a bit of the type of punishment that only a cretinous Patsy can dispense.  
 
She thinks she can "moderate" the ill effects he'll have on the other folks.
 
Good luck with THAT, girlfriend...
May 5, 2009, 6:12:19 PM EDT – Like – Reply


chris
Cecelia | 05.05.09 - 6:09 pm |
 
I hijacked the thread? How? by responding to them? when they talked to me or about me?? some would call that a discussion!!
May 5, 2009, 6:55:50 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
Johnny, thanks for the Baier link.
 
We live in a remarkable age that can give us these miracles sometimes.
May 5, 2009, 7:30:42 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
That cube video was hilarious! The monotonic speech synthesizer voice was an added touch.   :+: And it quoted Lloyd Bentsen.
May 5, 2009, 7:36:49 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Mike C.
Make that paraphrased Bentsen.
May 5, 2009, 7:37:19 PM EDT – Like – Reply


scraps
Within his goal of defending Fox News, News Hounds is right in his path. So as long as JB$ or News Hounds is around, JB$ is not going to quit bitching about News Hounds.
Posted by: AAP on Tue 5.5 3:25pm
 
What is it with this crowd? Why do they get so upset when someone does exactly what they themselves choose to do?
Blackflon | Homepage | 05.05.09 - 5:52 pm | #  
--------------
 
Who's "that crowd"?
You're referencing AAP, who annoyed most here and at OW, now he annoys the majority of those at NH but yet somehow he speaks for "that crowd".
May 5, 2009, 7:49:29 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
I hijacked the thread? How? by responding to them? when they talked to me or about me?? some would call that a discussion!!
chris | Homepage | 05.05.09 - 7:00 pm | #  
 
I'm just describing what happens, Chris. I'm not being a proponent of the reasoning over there.
 
Anyhoooo, sweety...you have your own forum for discussion now and at JD's you can post dissenting opinion, about all things cable news.  
 
Life goes on.
May 5, 2009, 7:52:37 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Who's "that crowd"?
You're referencing AAP, who annoyed most here and at OW, now he annoys the majority of those at NH but yet somehow he speaks for "that crowd".
scraps | 05.05.09 - 7:54 pm | #  
 
Actually, scraps, AAP is only paraphrasing Ellen.
 
She's expressly stated that a 'JD Sucks' thread is needed in order to combat the dire threat to the public record that is rendered up by this site...
 
Oh, it surprised me too, considering how much effort they make in assuring each other that this site is of no importance.  
May 5, 2009, 8:07:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
Well, Scraps, Cecelia correctly pointed out that it is the pack leader Ellen who has set the mission statement.
 
However, if that doesn't prove the point you could go to johnt, Aunty Em, Visitor55, Patrick et al, Claudo, Satan.......
 
Same song, different singer.
May 5, 2009, 9:16:00 PM EDT – Like – Reply


scraps
Who's "that crowd"?
You're referencing AAP, who annoyed most here and at OW, now he annoys the majority of those at NH but yet somehow he speaks for "that crowd".
scraps | 05.05.09 - 7:54 pm | #
 
Actually, scraps, AAP is only paraphrasing Ellen.
 
She's expressly stated that a 'JD Sucks' thread is needed in order to combat the dire threat to the public record that is rendered up by this site...
 
+++++
 
Yeah, and some OT regulars quit or threatened to over that thread.
 
I just think it's interesting that AAP gets quoted, which prompts Blackthon's asking what's wrong with "that crowd", yet if you read all of comments on that thread they run probably 15-1 against AAP (and many againast Ellen too).
 
Ellen's got her point of view for sure after a long history, but trust me, AAP isn't any more a part of the NH crowd than he is part of this crowd.
May 5, 2009, 9:29:44 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
Hey, everybody, listen up.
 
I just learned the MOST shocking news.
 
Did you know that Johnny is actually a paid, shall we say, agitprop of FNC and/or Murdoch?
 
"....Here's my theory. JD is probably funded by Fox News or News Corp or something/someone related, meaning it isn't going away, at least not until becomes completely ineffective --- which will only happen if everyone ignores it --- and then they will probably launch something else at you anyway.
 
So, here we have the classic stand-off.
 
1. Fox News exists purely to market the GOP and discredit the Democrats.
 
2. The News Hounds exists purely to discredit Fox News.
 
3. Johnny Dollar exists purely to discredit the News Hounds.
 
4. The JD thread exists purely to discredit Johnny Dollar.
 
--- you aren't exactly pissing in the wind. We all know you do good work and Fox are more accountable now (but probably also learning how to be more inconspicuous in the process) because of your good work.
 
There's not much JD can do to harm you, Ellen. Be wary and fight him on legal grounds where you can, but don't sink to his level (or allow us here to sink even lower) because it just isn't doing any good.
 
_________________
Posted by: wuzupdawk on Tue 5.5 12:16am"
 
Poor wuzupdawk. He obviously sees a conspiracy behind every keyboard that is not registered to the mutts.. What's worse is that he is convinced that disagreeing with him and his fellow mutts is also illegal in some way.
 
I have just one question to put to The Great Fox and His High Priest, Johnny Dollar.
 
As a loyal brain dead zombie where's my cut of the vig?
May 5, 2009, 9:31:00 PM EDT – Like – Reply


johnny dollar
I'm sorry Grammie, but Rupert...err, I mean Mr Murdoch, has instructed me that none of the secret payments I receive by anonymous messengers can be in any way shared. They can trace serial numbers, you know.
 
As for me trying to discredit the flea bags, that was accomplished long ago, maybe back when I exposed their 200th lie. Everything since then has been gravy.
May 5, 2009, 9:41:32 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
I agree scraps, AAP doesn't speak for NHs or anyone else on the aforementioned sites. Ellen appreciates him even if it's as nothing more than a useful idiot.
May 5, 2009, 9:54:00 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
"Ellen's got her point of view for sure after a long history, but trust me, AAP isn't any more a part of the NH crowd than he is part of this crowd.
scraps | 05.05.09 - 9:34 pm | # "
 
Although I didn't originally include dawk except in the et al he is a prime example.
 
The thread that you are using to make your point re the diversity of opinion at NH is more than outwieghed by the thousands of comments (2,000+ recently purged) that appear in many other threads.
 
This very true statement by you re Patsy actually puts the lie to your contention. While Patsy is unwelcome everywhere he goes he is still tolerated, if not welcomed, at The Kennel. Why do you think that might be.
 
Although you don't mention Patrick what explanation do you have for the fact that he was tolerated as long as he reserved his charming comments for the denizens of J$P?
 
The only basis I can see for your contention is that you really don't know much about The Kennel and the Hounds of the Baskervilles who roam there.
 
"but trust me, AAP isn't any more a part of the NH crowd than he is part of this crowd."
May 5, 2009, 10:09:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
Hey johnny, where's my cut? Surely FNC pays for Fox Fan too! You're holding off on me.
May 5, 2009, 10:18:04 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
"AAP you are truly in need of help"
Posted by: Halfpint on Tue 5.5 11:26am
 
Need we say more?
May 5, 2009, 10:28:07 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Blackflon
"....Here's my theory. JD is probably funded by Fox News or News Corp or something/someone related, meaning it isn't going away, at least not until becomes completely ineffective ---  
 
========================
 
Damn, the mailman must have forgotten to drop off my check from Rupert.
May 6, 2009, 8:35:33 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
Need we say more?  
Fox Fan | Homepage | 05.05.09 - 10:33 pm | #  
 
Well, frankly,you haven't said anything to start.
 
In AAP's statement that Blackflon excerpted, AAP was restating a point that Ellen had previously made.
 
As far as I can tell, Ellen is the "da man" at News Hounds. And there are lot more people at the site, than those who post on that thread.
 
That some of the NHers have criticized Ellen's view and that some of them have left (or are threatening to leave), in no way affords you the rationale to say that those who think as Ellen thinks do not constitute a large enough portion to be termed a constituency, a group, or as Blackflon put it: "a crowd".
 
Blackflon never made the point that AAP was that crowd's DESIGNATED spokesperson. In the fashion we find so typical of the NHers who come here, Scraps is refuting an argument that Blackflon never made.
 
However, it is not an unreasonable assumption that many there do back Ellen in this or would back her if made aware of the controversy. That group could logically be identified as "that crowd".
 
But beyond that, AAP is given a certain seal of approval simply for being tolerated in a site, not given to tolerance.
 
Scraps may not like that AAP is lumped in with the whole of NHs, but this is Ellen's doing. The lady has not hesitated to ban people. She HAS banned folks far less incendiary than AAP (exp: Grammie!...Chris!... Me!...Vstol!...)
 
Sorry, scraps, but AAP was Bob Cox's and Johnny Dollar's 'thorn in the side', in contrast, he's Ellen's champion.
 
You can thank her for the logical assumption that he's part of the family when he's sitting there at the table with the rest of you.
May 6, 2009, 9:51:35 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Fox Fan
Cecelia, I can't tell if you're arguing with me or with scraps or just arguing for the sake of arguing with anyone convenient, but i agree with you (even if your tone was somewhat bitchy).
 
My point was that AAP doesn't represent the NHs and that many of them can't stand him, possible even Ellen herself could be included in that group. She can use him without liking him. You're correct that Ellen is partially responsible for what he posts by allowing him there, but that wasn't my point. My point is that he is generally disliked there.
May 6, 2009, 8:54:16 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
"My point is that he is generally disliked there.
Fox Fan | Homepage | 05.06.09 - 8:59 pm | # "
 
FF, that is like saying that water is wet.
May 6, 2009, 9:41:19 PM EDT – Like – Reply


Cecelia
I'm just now finding your post here, FF.
 
I have to disagree with both you and Grammie, FF.
 
That AAP is an unlikable person is clear to anyone with more discernment than a possum. 
 
That he IS disliked by MANY of the people at News Hounds-- not so much.
 
(And it wasn't a bitchy tone, it was a "not-so-fast" tone.)
May 8, 2009, 3:20:41 AM EDT – Like – Reply


Grammie
"I have to disagree with both you and Grammie, FF."
 
Now that I'm over the vapors caused by Cecelia not agreeing totally with me I have to admit that she is quite right , FF.
 
Those that Patsy attacked suddenly 'got religion' as they say only after THEY were attacked. Only a very few objected to him and Patrick on principle. It took Pegleg a long time to come to the defense of her gal pals, Anisha and Aunty Em.
 
With a few exceptions all the anger and outrage was b/c their own rabid dogs turned on them!
May 8, 2009, 10:48:41 AM EDT – Like – Reply