Monday Links & Open Thread
Latest cable news links [6:30 pm]:
Woman of the Year.
CNN is hiring, could it be Jay Leno?
Huffington Post: Fox most fair!
Friday's numbers.
Gretawire review.
Cooperless Mole returns tonight.
MSNBC's non-denial denial?
Fourth Olby tax warrant surfaces!
Gaza pix; inside tunnels.
Q&A: Aaron Brown. Reax: Greta, Chickaboomer.
The McClellan Factor: audio preview.
What's a "strategist" anyhow?
Kilmeade commencement.
Hot & Not.
Campaign coverage critique.
FNC: a "threat to liberty"!
Use our valuable bandwidth to post your comments on any and all cable news topics in today's open thread. Standard rules apply. fox news cable news
Mike C.
In the same "New York" interview, Aaron Brown said a swear and praised Edward R. Olbermann. This means Aaron Brown is an Olbyloon. He lives a tortured existence which makes Keith so appealing. I'm sorry, Mr. Brown, but that's how Bob Cox over at OlbyWatch refers to Olbyloons.
June 2, 2008, 1:33:28 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Mike C.
Why am I apologizing? What are the odds Aaron Brown is going to show up here? Not even Barry Nolan has done that.
June 2, 2008, 1:35:02 AM EDT – Like – Reply
olby sucks
Aaron Brown hates our troops just as Olbrman does. Did you see Brown when he covered the war on cnn? He might as well have been wearing a turbin!
June 2, 2008, 1:39:33 AM EDT – Like – Reply
notveryhow
I know that some people think in absolutes,and to them there is absolutely no validity in any Third World perspective,but I think Al Jazeera would be a welcome addition to cable news choices.
June 2, 2008, 7:46:51 AM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
Is this the quote to which you are referring, Mike?:
Keith Olbermann and Bill O'Reilly "are both larger-than-life figures," he [Brown] says, but Olbermann is "smarter, funnier, better read and eminently more talented."
If so, it strikes me that this is a matter about which reasonable minds, no offense, Mr. Sucks, can differ. I don't think we can take a comparative and turn it into an absolute. Saying a Ford is better than a Chevrolet doesn't mean that either is good, nor that both are bad.
I am bereft of information about Countdown, and have little to offer about the Factor, either, but I do tend to think Olbermann may, in fact, be more talented than O'Reilly in the sense that Olbermann is more versatile. I can't see O'Reilly doing live election coverage, for example, at all. Remove him from scripts, teleprompters and the safety of a home set on which he can assault guests, and he is pretty much lost. Still, you see, that doesn't say Olbermann does it well, does it? My own sense is that he can do it, but not all that well. Still, that is one more talent than O'Reilly possesses.
I listen seriously to the criticism you and Johnny have of Olbermann, and I defer to you in your analysis of him (while valuing the opinions of Robert Cox and Mr. Sucks not in the least). But, if my assumption about the quotation is correct, I would part company from you over Brown.
As for the simplistic and absurd Arab-bashing comment which followed your comments, I ascribe that to you not at all. Just an unfortunate waster of a bit of cyberspace.
June 2, 2008, 8:17:55 AM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
NVH:
In my travels, I watch Al Jazeera, largely out of curiosity. The broadcasts have a level of professionalism to them and seem to strive for some level of objectivity as well. Of course, there is a different perspective involved. That seems to me to be the value of it. Akin to reading the Nation and the National Review for balance ....
Of course, people who have never seen Al Jazeera hold themselves up to be the ultimate authorities, so we get a woefully uninformed, but very loud critique of it. Volume seems to be a key atrribute of the uninformed.
June 2, 2008, 8:26:41 AM EDT – Like – Reply
VinceP1974
I definately recommend going to site to watch the creme de le creme of Middle East television.. all of it subtitled in english and transcripted.
www.memritv.org
There is nothing more insane than Middle East tv. In fact when I watch some of these shows, I have a hard time believe that human beings can say the things they are.
June 2, 2008, 8:42:31 AM EDT – Like – Reply
VinceP1974
Oh I forgot to add. sometimes you'll see some very couragous women and reformers on there.. who are brutal in their criticisms of Middle East society.
So if anyone wants to learn more the culture of the people who are determined to kill us, and the peolpe trapped in it trying to change it.. i definately recommend watching it.
June 2, 2008, 8:45:17 AM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
So if anyone wants to learn more the culture of the people who are determined to kill us, and the peolpe trapped in it trying to change it.. i definately recommend watching it.
---
This may only address part of the question, but it frames it very well, indeed. Thanks for an excellent perspective.
June 2, 2008, 8:54:21 AM EDT – Like – Reply
olby sucks
Watching the beheading videos gives all the perspective one needs.
June 2, 2008, 12:28:16 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Mike C.
Never mind what I said 11 hours ago. We seemed to have moved beyond that in the comments here.
I have something positive to say about Brian Kilmeade's commencement speech at Briarcliffe College, but I don't know how to phrase it. Besides, the rest of you would just ignore it and resume taking ideological corners.
June 2, 2008, 12:49:27 PM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
Actually, Mike, I would be interested. Brian is the only F&F personality I like and respect, and he is one of a handful at FNC I like and respect.
June 2, 2008, 12:52:18 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Vince
I read every word Mike writes
June 2, 2008, 2:23:30 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Mike C.
I didn't really know what to say anyway. I'm just glad for him. I didn't go to Briarcliffe, but I went to Brian's alma mater, C.W. Post.
Another damn demo win for KO. Hopefully, tonight will end that with McClellan on "The Factor."
June 2, 2008, 5:43:48 PM EDT – Like – Reply
cee
Woman of the Year is well deserved by Ms. Ingraham. Congratulations.
I wonder if Keith Olbermann is giving his old "friend" any kudos, especially after she called him out over his anti-troops rhetoric a couple of weeks ago.
June 2, 2008, 7:08:00 PM EDT – Like – Reply
John-O
It was a win in the demo for Countdown only because the Factor's numbers were so low. 304k?? Bill was practically in the 200s. Unusual.
June 2, 2008, 7:41:53 PM EDT – Like – Reply
david smawley
To Talkers Women of the year Laura Ingraham, way to go women and new mother of the year Laura Ingraham! Keep on keeping it on!
June 2, 2008, 10:09:22 PM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
It was a win in the demo for Countdown only because the Factor's numbers were so low.
---
We once won a football game against our chief and vastly superior rival largely because the rival scored so few points. Oddly, we didn't feel as if we lost.
I have no idea what the numbers will be tonight, but I have to say that "the" interview seemed to me to be a big flop. O'Reilly seemed tetherled. McClellan held his own, and O'Reilly went no where. Did I see O'Reilly get uncomfortable when McClellan kept driving home the point about changing the tone, ending the name-calling and bickering? Probably not. O'Reilly doesn't have that much integrity, but I felt like I was watching a Camus play with O'Reilly as protagonist. In other words, O'Reilly became the goat, and he wasn't vastly superior to anyone tonight, not even the hapless Olbermann.
June 2, 2008, 11:33:34 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Aeris Gainsborough
Interview of the Quacking Quackeroo, on O'Reilly, terrible, O'Reilly did not even bother to play the "violent fantasies" audio clip, that Bill O'Reilly made a "Top Story" with guest, Asha Rangappa. Olbermann spent more time, but that show with the Quacking Quackeroo, did not have my favorites: Bushed, Best, and Worst Persons.
As for Wh*ra F*graham, [bleep] her, Randi Rhodes, or Stephanie Miller, should have gotten it. Kim Komando, the "right-wing" computer, pro-corporation, talker, got the award, for "supporting the troops" which she actually doesn't, and I think that's why this Wh*ra got it, what a wh*re.
Please, Olbermann, nominate Wh*ra F*graham for WPITW.
June 3, 2008, 12:37:28 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Aeris Gainsborough
On the By The Way note, 6-2-2008 WPITW, on Olbermann, was funny, and unique.
June 3, 2008, 12:40:17 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Aeris Gainsborough
Whoops, I forgot Rachael Maddow, but I think Talkers might discriminate her, because of her sexuallity, then, we democrats, can sue Talkers.
June 3, 2008, 12:45:13 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Missy
Aeris, what is up with all the commas? None of us are perfect, but could you TRY to proofread before posting?
And leave Laura alone. You libs would do anything to have a strong, intelligent voice such as hers represent you on various topics.
June 3, 2008, 1:18:29 AM EDT – Like – Reply
johnny dollar
Aeris is testing the limits of my rules enforcement by hiding name-calling of Fox personalities amidst a cluster of asterisks, commas, and other punctuation. She apparently thinks that's "clever'.
It may be necessary to have the advisory board make another decision on whether we want to have comment threads mucked up with that sort of juvenalia. I will submit it to them for consideration and we may have a ruling shortly.
June 3, 2008, 1:21:44 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Mike C.
To answer Greta's question, I think a political strategist maps the future game plan, so to speak, for a given politician or political party. I could be wrong, but that's the impression I've gotten. I've actually said "take a listen" myself in teasing a clip or liner in one of my radio shows. But for Greta, I promise not to do it in the future.
June 3, 2008, 1:30:47 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Mike C.
Okay, not teasing a clip; setting up a clip.
Now, on to the Tuesday thread...but anyone else is free to comment here.
June 3, 2008, 1:31:45 AM EDT – Like – Reply
notveryhow
Akin to reading the Nation and the National Review for balance ....
Indeed,whether you consider them mortal enemies or mere political sparring partners,it is ALWAYS of benefit to understand what others are thinking,and perhaps more importantly,why?
June 3, 2008, 7:53:26 AM EDT – Like – Reply
Grammie
Let me put this thought about Fox News to NVH in a way that he might understand my view.
I know that some people think in absolutes,and to them there is absolutely no validity in any "conservative" perspective,but I think "Fox News" would be a welcome addition to cable news choices.
notveryhow | 06.02.08 - 7:51 am | #
I am sure that NVH would not take so much as a scintilla of offense at the implication that I might feel that he and his ilk, unlike we enlightened and intellectually curious and superior consevatives, only thinks in absolutes that are so limiting that he recoils from Fox News but views Al Jazeera as a welcome addition to his viewing life.
June 3, 2008, 10:41:50 AM EDT – Like – Reply
notveryhow
Grammie | 06.03.08 - 10:46 am |
When have I ever said that Fox News should be shut down.Sure,I complain about thier bias.It bugs the heck out of me sometimes.Just as you guys are troubled by KO's bias (which I freely acknowledge),and complain about it.Bitched about,yes,but surelyI wouldn't demand that Fox be shut down for bias anymore than you guys would demand KO's demise because of bias.
And I never thought of you as one who "thinks in absolutes".Why do you think you know what I think?But you must acknowledge that such people exist.
Would YOU oppose a cable net offering Al-Jazeera News?
June 3, 2008, 11:25:26 AM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
Indeed, Grammie, a closed mind gives one a profound sense of empowerment and is the foundation of a healthy, functioning democracy. I can't imagine why anyone would listen to any newssource other than FNC. After all, it is the American way.
More than that, information can be confusing. Can you imagine if Logan had been opened when the British were spotted?
One if by land.
Two if by see.
Flashing yellow if by air.
This meter makes me despair.
Now, I've got a headache,
In need some aspirin to take,
Someone else can keep guard,
My head's throbbing, O, Lord,
Too much to process,
Information is best when it is less.
June 3, 2008, 11:33:37 AM EDT – Like – Reply
olby sucks
surelyI wouldn't demand that Fox be shut down for bias anymore than you guys would demand KO's demise because of bias.
by nvh
The only problem with this is there is no comparison. Apples and atom bombs.
June 3, 2008, 11:49:43 AM EDT – Like – Reply
notveryhow
i don't watch much TV news.It takes too much time and one learns too little.A little CNN headline news,some election coverage,and sometimes in the morning I'll draw the curtains,lock the door and watch Fox and friends with the sound off (with captions).
I try to understand how people reach the conclusions they do,and knowing the information they have is helpful.It is also (as I'm sure all broadcasts are) occasionally hilarious.
They were covering the SF tiger affair,and a woman (sorry,don't know their names) said to their local stringer, I quote, "I hear this animal had a history of violence".My son also heard,and fell off his chair laughing.
June 3, 2008, 12:06:52 PM EDT – Like – Reply
VinceP1974
"A little CNN headline news"
I like Glenn Beck too
June 3, 2008, 1:57:27 PM EDT – Like – Reply
notveryhow
VinceP1974 | Homepage | 06.03.08 - 2:02 pm |
Somehow that's not suprising.
June 3, 2008, 3:16:14 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Cecelia
Well, Johnny, your status has certainly changed with On The Clucker. It used to be that Bob Cox was the reasonable man and you were the guy who was not worth considering...
Other days...other blogs...other smoke to blow...
Of course, Grammie never voiced a desire that Al Jazeera be shut down or even be made unavailable to the U.S. consumer, despite that hasty bit of revisionism from you both, OTM and nvh. If Al Jazeera has a blog devoted to covering it, as this one does FNC, I'm not sure whether she's even over at it "speaking truth to power"... but I doubt it...
What she did do was to make brilliantly clear, from your own words, and your own focus at this blog, a prime piece of irony that Johnny should frame and place at the top of the blog as a touchstone revelation of the mindset of so many FNC critics who pass this way...
I can completely understand how you wished to quickly shift the focus negatively to her, OTM, and now you would be more quick than usual to miss the point, nvh, but it was an iconic bit of posting on a blog devoted to a particular topic as can be seen.
Johnny, it there was a way to encapsulate it into a frame, it would be priceless.
June 3, 2008, 4:26:24 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Grammie
NVH, I had no idea that recoil meant banned. Please excuse me. In an effort not to be catergorized again(NOT by you) as a dull uninmaginative jackbooted sheeple I obviously stretched my vocabulary beyond its monolithic limits.
I repeated your argument verbatim with just three substitutions for four words, ie I made the same argument about FNC and its viewers that you made about third world news/Al Jazeera.
I thought your statement made certain implications that were not quite flattering to those you were judging. I took that and verbalized it to the maximum inference that could be drawn from it.
I took exception to the manner you used to make your point. You did not in any way raise any reasons why it would be better for everyone if Al Jazeera were available widely. You instead made a statement of what ails some of those folks, Fox watchers, that the open minded progressive minds are not prey to.
I'm fairly sure that you really didn't intend it so much as an insult but simply expressed your own belief that has been reinforced and gained legitimacy in your mind by the never ending mantra of FOX BAD through so much of our media and blogs.
However, you made the statement in a venue that is comprised of thirty or forty people at most and that gives your statement an added fillip and a bit more intimacy.
Besides, I'm in a bad mood today!
June 3, 2008, 4:57:42 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Grammie
Cecelia, you are definitely The Commenter of the Month with this bon mot:
On the Clucker
June 3, 2008, 5:07:43 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Cecelia
Well, I went back and forth between On The Clucker and some moniker based on the post from Bob Cox stating:
'"A N O N Y M O U S" is also "Mrs. R. Adrian Philby" and "Rudy Ramirez" and "M Schultz" and "Kurt Kissel"'
But brevity is the soul of wit...
June 3, 2008, 5:22:59 PM EDT – Like – Reply
On The Mark
I would suggest, Johnny, you start a charge for heavy, clumsy baggage. You'd make a fortune. Much more than off the tiresome Name Game Redux.
Please Vince, don't tell me you like Glenn Beck. I have come to enjoy your perspective. Hannity, O'Reilly, Dobbs. OK. But not Glenn Beck.
June 3, 2008, 5:48:35 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Cecelia
Please do, Johnny.
Make Lucette pay to not be reminded of his former selves.
June 3, 2008, 6:33:09 PM EDT – Like – Reply
olby sucks
You scooped me on the "Lucette" one, Cecelia. I never saw those.
June 3, 2008, 6:59:31 PM EDT – Like – Reply
Cecelia
OS, you didn't miss anything. He's not exactly Lawrence Olivier or....Meryl Streep.
It's either stilted conservatives using words like "hain't" or arrogant patricians.
June 3, 2008, 7:08:23 PM EDT – Like – Reply
